Episode 61

Shane Mercer [00:00:00]:

Pace, I think this is a good example of somebody who, you know, very quickly and very easily got caught up in the in the North American betting hype, and, he had access. Right? He had access to funds through, you know, Ohtani.

Andrew Pace [00:00:15]:

That's one way of saying it. Yeah. I mean, he doesn't he doesn't he doesn't have that kind of money.

Shane Mercer [00:00:19]:

No. He certainly doesn't.

Andrew Pace [00:00:21]:

If he does, sign me up for being an interpreter.

Andrew Pace [00:00:23]:

I'll go learn language for that kind of money.

Shane Mercer [00:00:36]:

Hello, and welcome to another episode of Behind the Lines, the only podcast purifying the sports betting industry. Remember to like, download, subscribe, follow us on all the socials @ inplayLIVE. If you wanna see what it's all about on the inside, we've got that promo code for you 'BEHINDTHELINES', all caps. Alright. On today's show, gambling disorders on the rise in North America. Surprise. Surprise. A guilty plea from Shohei Ohtani's interpreter, a little book shake up with Bette Regal becoming North Star, at least on the north side of the border.

Shane Mercer [00:01:09]:

And, we'll talk a little bit about what FanDuel's got going on looking to enter the streaming landscape, and we'll talk a little bit about how that might work. Alright. I'm your host as always, Shane Mercer, that guy over there, Andrew Pace, the founder of the most sophisticated sports betting community on planet Earth that is inplayLIVE. Again, one more time, I'll remind you all about that promo code 'BEHINDTHELINES', all caps. Pace, how are you doing, my man?

Andrew Pace [00:01:36]:

Never better, Shane.

Shane Mercer [00:01:37]:

Good to hear. Good to hear. We're starting the show off on a bit of a serious note, but I think it's really important that we talk about these things. I think that this is what makes this podcast very different from other sports betting podcasts. As, you know, we're not afraid to talk about the dark side of this business that we engage in. And, you know, it can be pretty pretty serious, and the consequences can be pretty dire when not approached in a responsible way. So Forbes out with an article, this past week, and highlighting the rise of gambling disorders in in North America. And, I'll just sort of riff off some of the some of the stats here, but the National Council on Problem Gambling, and this is specifically in, in America, but I think that, you know, it can very easily be applied to all of North America and, on on the north side of the border as well here in Canada.

Shane Mercer [00:02:28]:

But the National Council on on Problem Gambling estimates that approximately 2 and a half 1000000 adults in the US are severely addicted to gambling, and another 4 to 6000000 people have mild to moderate gambling problems. So that's almost 10,000,000 people that have some kind of, gambling issue, in, North America or at least in America according to this study. But, the American Psychiatric Association and the American Medical Association would, you know, recognize a a pathological or compulsive gambling as a diagnosable mental disorder. It's characterized by preoccupation with wagers, not being able to to cut down or stop, repeatedly going beyond one's means, borrowing money to finance the habit, chasing losses, you know, a lot of these things we we've talked about here on this show before. And, you know, this can have a major impact on someone's physical health or mental health. And, in addition to, obviously, the big financial consequences that come from it, you know, it can also, you know, lead to, serious mental health disorders and even even suicide affects young adults. So big sort of expose here, PACE, in in in Forbes focusing on, on this issue. And, you know, I wanted to to talk about it because over the past couple of weeks, you know, we talked a little bit about my success a couple of shows ago.

Shane Mercer [00:03:56]:

We had, Adam Bjorn on, a guy who has made an entire life out of being successful in this business. And if you guys haven't heard that episode or listened to that episode, I certainly encourage you to go back and have a listen. But, PACE, with the rise of sports betting in North America, the frequency of the ads, the use of celebrities, you know, all of these kinds of tactics that the sportsbooks are using that we've covered, you know, widely here on the show. It it it's all you know, it it's easy to get caught up in the hype, especially if you're just an average person out there, and I think maybe that's what we're seeing. But but what do you think when you when you see an article like this?

Andrew Pace [00:04:34]:

I mean, I'm not surprised, and I think, like, the last thing I would wanna do on the show is, like, start talking about politics. But, you know, there's record debt out there, especially across North America. And this is a new revenue stream, obviously, that that, was brought into a lot of these states and provinces. Right? So then you have this whole discussion of, you know, the catering to losing players. And then when you cater to losing players and you don't have winning players, guess what the product of that is is gonna become? Like, you're gonna have a bunch of people chasing chasing losses and chasing a a big win, a lottery type payout that the sportsbooks just just profit off of over the long term. And if you actually think about, like, I guess, like, other things across our history, so, like, a really good example would be, like, smoking cigarettes, and, like, the history of cigarettes where, like, the ads and, like, the what's the TV show with Jon Hamm?

Shane Mercer [00:05:35]:

Oh, Mad Men.

Andrew Pace [00:05:36]:

Mad Men. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like, the ads during that time frame, like, essentially, like, everyone's smoking in their offices. It would be crazy not to smoke because you're basically being told that it's healthy at those times.

Andrew Pace [00:05:48]:

Right? Like, you could just say and

Andrew Pace [00:05:50]:

do whatever you wanted, like, total wild wild west approach to to advertising and marketing. Right? And then, you know, you fast forward to say, like, you know, the nineties. And I remember, like, coming up in elementary school and, like, we learned about there was, like, people that came in to tell us before we got to high school about how bad smoking is for you. You know? And I remember, like, being afraid to go to high school because I didn't want to be off. Like, I was afraid to be offered a cigarette. Like, it was so as a kid, it was, like, so ingrained in my mind that you do not want to do this thing and how bad it is for you, that, for me, at least, it was pretty easy, you know, to to pass on on going down that avenue. But, like, just take that sort of I know that was like a a 40 year window that I just referenced right there, 40 or 50 year window. You fast forward to today, and I know obviously people smoke cigarettes, but, it is far less, quote, cool than it was in the 50, 60, seventies, eighties, to to be smoking, today than it than it was then.

Andrew Pace [00:07:01]:

You know, you could you could put a similar lens on the whole gambling thing. Right? It's this cool thing that everyone's doing, and it's so easy to win. You know? And then fast forward a few years later, and here we are with, you know, this article that's come out, representing that shocker. Hey. Some people have some gambling problems. And and the legalization of sports betting has put those problems, like, really under the spotlight or magnified them to the point that, like you said, like, you you went right right to suicide there in in in what you brought up. So, yeah, it shows you that it's more than it's more than just the simple act of saying yes or no. Because any smoker will tell you, hey.

Andrew Pace [00:07:52]:

I'd love to quit. Right? I can't. It's too hard. It's too too challenging. Like, the nicotine is one of the most, if not the most addictive substance in the world. You you can't just drop it. It's like us right now saying, hey. Stop breathing.

Andrew Pace [00:08:07]:

You know? It's part of their their day to day necessity. So can people quit? Yeah. Of course, they can quit smoking. Tons of people have, but it isn't easy. And even once you do quit, it doesn't mean that you don't think about just like, holy fuck. Like, it would be insane to have a puff right now. Right? And this is coming from a guy that I've I've actually never smoked anything in my life, believe it or not, which is kinda crazy being in BC and saying that.

Shane Mercer [00:08:32]:

Never smoked anything? Like, never even tried anything? No. Wow. Alright. Well, learning something about pace here, guys.

Andrew Pace [00:08:40]:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, this is coming for like, I guess I understand that I I have empathy for. Like, I can't actually put myself in that position. So from a gambling standpoint, think about it like it's nicotine. Right? A lot of these people that are in a position like this, it is, it is an unhealthy relationship, but one that they can't easily, put aside. And then they flick on their TV, and it's in their face.

Andrew Pace [00:09:10]:

And, you know, maybe they self excluded at their favorite sportsbook. Right? And then they they find out they got a free $1,000 at the next one. And, I mean, there's no it's no secret here. I I can definitely tell you in the unregulated space that I get advertising for sportsbooks that I've never signed up for all the time. Like, all the time. So lists are shared, information shared, maybe it's sold. You know? But, yeah, we're being inundated left left, right, and center. And, to ask for protection at the government level is something that we've obviously explored to an extent with the whole, you know, you're only limiting you're limiting winning players, and this is what the sportsbooks are doing, and these are the practices.

Andrew Pace [00:09:54]:

And we've seen some measures taken. You know, you can't use the term free bet and celebrity endorsements are banned in Ontario and and things like that. But to to to think that, the government that is reliant upon this new income stream is going to be, you know, really able to make massive change now that it has has arrived is is probably a little bit naive. So, you know, that puts the onus back on you. You have to be the person that's making the smart, responsible decisions for your future, Whether you are a sports bettor who's looking to make money or go down a journey of being profitable with it, or someone that just needs to completely quit entirely. You've gotta you've gotta take responsibility and and take that make that drastic change. And one of the biggest ways to not gamble on sports is to not be in environments that promote it. So, like, you know, it might it might mean not watching sports, not, like, you you might be like, well, I I have to watch the NBA finals.

Shane Mercer [00:11:03]:

Well, this is the thing now, though, Paces. Like, you can't not watch sports and not have it in your face.

Andrew Pace [00:11:10]:

Yeah. You well, this is what I'm saying. Like, I'm talking cutting the cables, everything.

Shane Mercer [00:11:15]:

Right. Like, I gotta keep up my my sports passions, you know, because I I've you know, I I just can't handle the the ads in my face. That's that's a that's a tough thing for a lot of sports fairs. Yeah.

Andrew Pace [00:11:25]:

I mean, it's it's on the ice in the Canucks rank. They're in the playoffs right now, Betway. It's sitting on the the ice there. And, it's funny because they say, oh, PlayNow is the only licensed and safe place to play in British Columbia. Well, meanwhile, you, in theory, have an offshore book on the ice, in front of you if you were to just go to a Canucks game and be like, oh, I wanna enjoy it. And then, you know, all of a sudden, just that just reading that word, that could be the trigger where you go, oh, I wonder if they have a bonus because I'll take the free bonus, and then I'm not actually gambling because it's not this, that, or the other.

Andrew Pace [00:12:01]:

And before you know it, you're back in the infrastructure. Yeah. So, I mean, the whole thing is, like, it's no surprise in any way, shape, or form. And and I think to an extent, you know, various states and government regulators that are involved in this knew what they were getting into, but the counterargument to this is gonna be that, you know, $400,000,000,000 was illegally wagered in 2,017 17 in the United States. So, you know, does that mean, oh, x amount of heroin was consumed illegally in in the United States this year? So should we legalize it based on that rationale? Well, well, they've done that in Vancouver.

Shane Mercer [00:12:44]:

I was just gonna say, you guys are experimenting with that right now, and it's I I gotta say, just as an observer from afar, I don't think it's going so well.

Andrew Pace [00:12:52]:

Yeah. No. I can't tell you firsthand. It's not going well at all. But it's interesting because we're planning the, we're planning the inplayLIVE pro event, and it's an ongoing thing now. You know, there's new planning steps being taken every day, every week right now. And it's it's funny because they're like, you know, we're booking the field for softball, and they'll say, like,

Andrew Pace [00:13:13]:

"We are confirming that there will not be alcohol"

Andrew Pace [00:13:16]:

And I'm like, you can inject fentanyl in our parks, and you're concerned about whether or not we're gonna have a drink, in the park. But, yeah, I mean, like, I guess what I'm saying is using that rationale is, oh, it's happening anyways, so then let's just legalize it. Where is the line on that being valid? So when it comes to sports betting and it happening anyways and then profiting off of the losses of it instead of, like, you know, a company in Curacao or in the UK profiting from it, and and their governments benefiting from from that operation versus ours. I mean, yeah, there's a debate there and there's a discussion to be had. And, at the end of the day, for for, like, selfishly speaking, I do want, sports betting to to be out there and to be present. And I think the whole the our whole position is is helping people do that more effectively. But but like you said, hey. We're not afraid to have these conversations.

Andrew Pace [00:14:15]:

So, you know, just just getting it all out there and and making sure people do have that awareness. So, like, if you are someone who's new to sports betting or you're a losing bettor that's now trying to win, don't be the person that doesn't recognize that this is the environment and industry that we're in. Don't be that person. Like, be the person that knows and is aware aware of it so that if it is happening to you, you can go, oh, fuck. This is not for me before it gets to these really dark levels.

Shane Mercer [00:14:51]:

Well, that that's exactly it. And that's why I wanted to make sure that we're we're talking about it here because, you know, a big part of this is, knowing yourself and, understanding that, you know, for this is I'm really now speaking to a lot of the people that are already in inplayLIVE and in our community. You know, don't forget that this is a dangerous space, and you need to approach it with a seriousness, you know, that that it requires because the consequences of, you know, sort of getting caught up in all the fun of it, and it is a ton of fun. We have a lot of fun at inplayLIVE, but getting caught up in that, you know, it can become easy to lose sight of the fact that this is a serious business, you know, and and you need to treat it in a very serious way. And it's it's easy to sort of forget about that and kinda get lost up in the bigger caught up in the moments of of big wins or big moments in sports and and sort of enjoying that with the group and the community, and all of that is awesome. You know? But, we're sort of entering a time of year where things, you know, kind of, you know, get a little bit slower in terms of the the amount of wagers maybe we're placing, you know, and and and, you know, there's there's maybe you know, it it can sort of be easy to kind of maybe start betting on things you didn't bet on before. Maybe betting on things that aren't proven in your tracker. You know? And it it can be very easy to sort of get caught up in all of that at this time of year especially.

Andrew Pace [00:16:16]:

Well, you know, it's a it's a good point that you bring up their shame because Jesse Lermont, who we we we had on the podcast, I was actually on his podcast as well. And I think it's a great episode because, it's called the Betting Startups podcast. And if you guys aren't following that that show, I would recommend that you you do so. But I I was hosted on that show. And Jesse's got great insight from the standpoint of not being a winning bettor himself, which he he talked about on on that episode. But being such a prominent person that, you know, has worked for Pinnacle and has now become the the CEO of a new betting, company that hopefully we'll get to touch on soon with him.

Shane Mercer [00:16:53]:

Oh, that'd be great.

Andrew Pace [00:16:54]:

On on the show, which I'm really excited for.

Shane Mercer [00:16:55]:

Yeah. I would love to have him back.

Andrew Pace [00:16:57]:

Yeah. Yeah. But, basically, you know, knowing the lens of being a business in this industry largely being based off of customer loss. And if you are starting something in this industry, that you are likely to an extent dependent upon making money off of the sportsbooks winning money. So, again, based on people losing. He really has seen, you know, the entrepreneurs that are on that side of things. Right? And one of the biggest things that he said on the episode, that really resonated with me was, there's the sports betting side of things, but that ultimately is a hook to get you onto the casino. Right.

Andrew Pace [00:17:47]:

And now back to sort of my lens at inplayLIVE and what I have seen. I have seen some of our biggest and best success stories, go belly up kind of with what you were touching on, Sheen. So you're touching on a a a time of year where perhaps you as a sports bettor who's had it ingrained into your life as something that you're doing throughout a big chunk of the day or a big chunk of the week have that fall off to not quite the same extent, and then you sitting there going, what am I gonna do with my time? And you start playing on different sports or trying different strategies that that that create loss. Well, the other one is going to the freaking casino. And you go, oh, and you almost carry over this this I'm a successful sports bettor into the casino. Like, I'm gonna go win now. Right? And one of the biggest draws of gambling, whether it's sports betting or otherwise, is that it is common to get some of those wins. It it's not uncommon to be up.

Andrew Pace [00:18:58]:

I'm up on this and that. Right? So you might get a little bit of that at the blackjack table or roulette table or whatever the case and think that it's just gonna repeat itself. And that's where, like, statistics have to be the backbone of your decision making. So, like, if I'm gonna spin a roulette wheel, unless I've found a wheel that has either a really good dealer there that's spinning it that knows exactly what he's doing, on your team, or you have some sort of warped, part of the table that's produced it's a thing. It's a thing, Shane. It's a thing.

Shane Mercer [00:19:34]:

It's a thing. Okay.

Andrew Pace [00:19:35]:

It's a thing. You know, you have a bit of a warped table that's producing certain numbers. So there's there's been, you know, roulette guys that have studied wheels, where they go in and out and get as much data on that wheel as they possibly can, and then they go in and kick the shit out of that table before the wheel gets changed over. That's happened. Right? So unless you have some sort of edge like that, you are you are statistically, placing wagers that that the more volume you apply to them, the more money you're gonna lose. And and I guess what I'm getting at is they just simply don't carry over. So don't be the person that, you know, has done well within PlayLive that then turns the corner and and becomes a gambler. It just doesn't it's never gonna work in your favor.

Shane Mercer [00:20:18]:

No. No. It really isn't. And and, you know, I think I touched on it in in the episode where we sort of talked about my story a couple weeks ago, but, you know, I was sort of went through a process of that where I took a strategy at inplayLIVE and thought I could apply it in other leagues around the world, and it didn't work out. You know? And there's a reason that it doesn't work out, ya know.

Andrew Pace [00:20:38]:

But I like that you did that.

Shane Mercer [00:20:40]:

Well, you know, I guess, it was it was, you know, something where, again, maybe trying to fill that time, you know, where I was sort of at that sort of part of the season and and, like, oh, now what? Oh, well, I can do it over here. You know? And it it's, you know, not that it it wasn't worth trying. And and, you know, I I did get off of it once I saw it wasn't working, but it was just that mindset of, you know, oh, I gotta do something else now, you know, to to sort of get to to fill that time. I for anybody out there that is going through that and trying to figure out how to fill the time, I got a much, much better way to go about it. It's, just focus on the premium ops. Pace will tell you which ones those are, you know, if you're in the Amplify Live community. And spend the rest of the time with the people you love. Yeah.

Shane Mercer [00:21:18]:

That that's that's probably my best advice there. You know, spend spend that time with people in your life that that have allowed you to spend the other part of the season that's sort of behind us now so engrossed in in this thing. That that that would be my biggest advice. Alright. Let's move on a little bit. And, we're still sort of staying with the topic, but a little bit lighter here and, maybe sort of more into the celebrity realm of things. But, you know, celebrities get caught up in this whole gambling thing as well, and we all know, if you're big into sports, you know the Shohei Ohtani story by this point. Well, his, interpreter, and I'm gonna butcher his name here.

Shane Mercer [00:21:54]:

Hope hopefully, I don't. But, Ipe Mizuhara, his interpreter has agreed to a, to plead guilty. He's pleading guilty to one count of bank fraud and one count of, subscribing to a false tax return. He's accused of stealing $17,000,000 from Ohtani. Sky's facing up to 33 years in prison for for those, for the for those charges he's pleading guilty to. You know, he bet a $142,000,000 over the course of his his betting, history there. Sorry. Sorry.

Shane Mercer [00:22:26]:

His winnings totaled a 142,000,000, but his losses were a 183,000,000. So net loss, $41,000,000. You know, he didn't wager on baseball for anyone out there that's wondering, was he betting on Ohtani? No. He wasn't. He wasn't betting baseball at all. But, you know, pace I think this is a good example of somebody who, you know, very quickly and very easily got caught up in the in the North American betting hype, and, he had access. Right? He had access to funds through, you know, Ohtani.

Andrew Pace [00:22:59]:

That's one way of saying it. I mean, he doesn't he doesn't he doesn't have that kind of money.

Shane Mercer [00:23:03]:

No. He certainly doesn't.

Andrew Pace [00:23:04]:

If he does sign me up for being an interpreter, I'll go learn, I'll go learn

Andrew Pace [00:23:09]:

a language for that kind of money. Yeah.

Andrew Pace [00:23:11]:

I mean, honestly, though so this obviously ties in with the, the the Jontay Porter stuff.

Shane Mercer [00:23:16]:

Yeah. Jontay Porter stuff.

Andrew Pace [00:23:17]:

Know if you've heard about this, Shane, but there's discussion now for sportsbooks only offering overs on player props. Have you heard about this?

Shane Mercer [00:23:24]:

Really? Only overs.

Shane Mercer [00:23:28]:

You can't bet the under? I have not heard about this.

Andrew Pace [00:23:30]:

Okay. So, you know, you we talk we bring up ROGA and sportsbooks like merging. And, you know, we talk about responsible gaming tools where we're getting logged out, which only affects winners, really. It's sportsbooks look at angles in these situations, and the net result is how can it benefit us. So think about having a line that you no longer need to balance for profitability. So let's just say that, the production from, Steph Curry is approximately 26.5 points per game. Oftentimes with player props, overs tend to be the more exciting, more fun side to wager on.

Shane Mercer [00:24:17]:

Yeah. Not a lot of people are underous on on props. Yeah.

Andrew Pace [00:24:20]:

Well, there there might be a line at 27a half for him then. So the there's a vague, obviously, and then on top of the vague, they've increased it a point above his average. And then, obviously, where he's playing, who's guarding him, trends in the last few games, like, all that stuff can factor in. Right? Like, if he's if he's dropped 35, 3 or 4 games in a row, that total might even though the average was 26a half, that total might be closer to 30. Right? So there's a whole series of factors that go into setting a line. But one of the biggest factors, is is where those lines makers see profitability, from the standpoint of taking, action that's gonna be balanced. And as a bookmaker, when money comes in, especially if it's significant money and it's sharp money, which probably now at this point, yes, there's tons of sharp money on player props, but it's hard to get, consistent and long term money in in on player props. So you're you're gonna look towards main markets.

Andrew Pace [00:25:17]:

But as that big heavy action comes in that is is viewed as sharp, as a bookmaker, you have the option to, close the line and bring it back at a a new number, adjust the line, or say bring it on and keep the line. And when you say bring it on, the reason why I say that is because if you have 90% of all of your money on one side of a line and you don't move that line, if the other side of it hits, you know, you're getting 10 to 1 on a wager that's theoretically a coin flip or close to a coin flip. So there's some bookmakers where they go, I know my exposure on, you know, this side of this line is really gonna hurt, but the upside is worth it. And statistically speaking over time, even though the sharp money is over there, the odds I'm getting on the other side are are worth are worth, you know, worth essentially, keeping. So now imagine where it's illegal to have an under because of guys like, let's say, Ohtani being involved with this interpreter. It sounds like he was just a terrible gambler, but then, obviously, Porter being someone who is

Shane Mercer [00:26:24]:

Mhmm.

Andrew Pace [00:26:24]:

He's actually, you know, involved in in rigging player props and things like that. That means that this 26 point 5 average that I'm referencing, they can set the line at 35a half at minus 110 and just basically trap people into cheering for their players with full control over negative expected value beyond beyond reason. So, like, just think about that.

Shane Mercer [00:26:48]:

Wow.

Andrew Pace [00:26:49]:

You know? As opposed to having it, like, someone punish, punish you know, they sign what they need to sign. They have their contracts, and then having them punished, banished, whatever, where you go, you just can't do this stuff, guys. It's it's not, it's not worth it. Instead, it's like the sportsbooks upside for this this stuff happening is now potentially, colossally massive. Like, we're just so much so, Shane, that we would be crazy to bet on a player prop ever.

Shane Mercer [00:27:20]:

Yeah. Well, that's exactly it.

Andrew Pace [00:27:22]:

Yeah.

Shane Mercer [00:27:22]:

Yeah. Like, I mean, why would you go and bet on a player prop that if you know that that you can only bet the over and the number's higher than it should be, right, you would just stay away. But I get it. Right? There there are a lot of people out there that wanna bet the prop, but they just wanna cheer for their players. Right? And I guess that's that's who the sportsbooks would would be targeting in those cases.

Andrew Pace [00:27:41]:

And it'll it it I mean, that would the people will still be betting on player props.

Shane Mercer [00:27:44]:

Yeah. You're right. You're right. Yeah. They'll they'll be they'll be betting on the props. They'll probably be same game parlaying those props with other overs on other players that they like. You know? Yeah.

Andrew Pace [00:27:53]:

But the the the revenue, from the that side of the business, which is not high at all, like sorry. Not the revenue. The profitability, is not high on that side of things at all for sports folks at all.

Shane Mercer [00:28:05]:

Yeah.

Andrew Pace [00:28:05]:

And, it would increase significantly.

Shane Mercer [00:28:07]:

Yeah. Yeah. Like, prop markets are sort of, you know, something that that a lot of people out there, especially a lot of pregame bettors are are have been taking advantage of over the last, cup couple of years. You know, they've been a heavy focus, in in a lot of different sports and and still is. So, yeah, it'll be interesting to kinda see where where things go there. On the sportsbooks side of things, we've got a bit of a a change up, something that is, affecting a lot of the people, in in Canada. BetRegal, it was I don't know if this is still gonna be the case, probably not, but it has been the official sports betting partner of the CFL. It's no longer taking bets in Canada and will instead become a North Star Bets.

Shane Mercer [00:28:50]:

Pace, I never bet on BetRegal. I don't think it was part of the Ontario regulated markets. So and I could be wrong on that, but I don't think so. I know North Star Bets is, but, I'm assuming that that you use BetRegal at some point in your sports betting career. What do you think of this change?

Andrew Pace [00:29:08]:

It's it's not a big deal, for anyone. If you guys really like to BetRegal and their lines, their lines are readily available via offshore betting. So I'll just run through a little list for any of our viewers, and I will not get all of them, but those same lines are at WagerWeb, Heritage Sports, Jazz Sports, ABC Islands, U Wager, and many more. So, you can go get those lines. They're great. I use them all the time. A lot of local bookies actually use that same system. But I do find it more interesting, like, the the the economics or the business side of it, like, to have to be one of the major sponsors of of, yeah, the CFL, and then to to basically I I don't know if fold is the right term, but to move over to to another platform is is interesting.

Andrew Pace [00:30:00]:

Now whenever this kind of stuff happens, it's always a little bit of a curiosity thing. Like, okay. I was limited at BetRegal, and I don't have a NorthStar Bets account. Am I gonna be limited at NorthStar Bets? I, I was limited at NorthStar Bets already. My BetRegal is moved over there, but I was a good customer. I was not limited at BetRegal. Will I now be still limited at NorthStar Bets? And then I've been limited at both. Will will somehow this transition give me give me another crack? So those are always the questions that are of interest to me.

Andrew Pace [00:30:34]:

I'm actually I just updated my details over at, Northstar Bets. And, I I don't mind, if if somehow this causes adversity for my personal accounts, but I was limited at BetRegal. I was not limited at NorthStar Bets, but I had an account. And I got an email saying, the balance if there are any balances, like, they'll be transferred and combined into 1 and, you know, since I already had an account. So we will see if the limitations cross over for me. I don't think they will, but we shall find out. And for those of you that don't know, NorthStar bets is, a Cambie sportsbook. So that is their odds provider.

Andrew Pace [00:31:16]:

They do have an app. I can't speak to, whether or not it's a site that is reputable, but in as a general statement, can be, with some effort. They do they do pay you out. I have a a really bad can be story, but, that was from a mistake that I made. So, yeah, always exciting when there's some sort of book change to see what opportunities that that will, that will give us.

Shane Mercer [00:31:42]:

Yeah. And, for anyone in Ontario, North Star Bets is in Ontario. It's part of the regulated market, so, you can you can trust it from that point of view that, you know, you know, if you if you bet something there, like, PACE is saying too, like, you know, Canby pays out, a lot of, a lot of their their lines, that that may be off or something like that. And and in Ontario, it is part of the regulated market. So, you you won't have too many issues. You you'll probably still get limited, though, pretty quickly. You know, if you're if you're winning bets, and and you were limited on BetRegal, you might get new life. I don't know how long that new life will live for you.

Shane Mercer [00:32:18]:

Yep.

Andrew Pace [00:32:19]:

Yeah. Yeah.

Shane Mercer [00:32:20]:

Good good chance. You'll you'll get limited pretty quickly there too. But, hey. That means you're winning, which is what Yep. It's all about. Yep. Alright. Another book doing something interesting, and, this one is a bit bigger.

Shane Mercer [00:32:31]:

It's FanDuel, and they're launching Fast TV. So FanDuel wants to be a streamer. It's lost launched this thing called Fast Channel. It's free, so it comes with ads. It will air live sports, and it'll also include some interview shows and some analysis shows. Pace, maybe they'll they'll want us to to be on Fast channel one day. You know? They might approach us. There's there's always a chance, I suppose.

Shane Mercer [00:32:57]:

You know, but you're gonna have people affiliated with FanDuel telling you what to bet on, which is, you know, always problematic. I would take any of that with a grain of salt. But they're gonna be broadcasting horse racing, poker, Korean soccer, professional darts. They'll have basketball from China, Germany, Turkey. You'll be able to find this on, on Roku and Pluto TV, and and FanDuel TV plus. So we got a sportsbook, and and many sportsbooks, and and every anybody out there who has, you know, quite a few sportsbooks will know this by now that you can watch a lot of the games on these sportsbooks. A lot of different sportsbooks are broadcasting different, you know, different, games and events from around the world. Pretty regularly.

Shane Mercer [00:33:37]:

It's the kind of thing where, you know, if it's if it's something overseas that you would never be broadcast in your in your home state or province, you know, then there's a chance that you might be able to watch it on a sportsbook somewhere. But this is a little bit more, you know, into the streaming space, and it's something I don't think we've really kind of seen from a lot of sportsbooks yet.

Andrew Pace [00:33:58]:

Yeah. So have they touched on latency, Shane?

Shane Mercer [00:34:01]:

No. The name other than the name? Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Right. No. I didn't see any sort of comments around latency or or anything like that.

Andrew Pace [00:34:11]:

So, you know, I mean, like, I guess when I saw this right away, like, obviously, we've we've talked about some of the dark sides of gambling on this episode. Right right away, you know, I'm excited.

Shane Mercer [00:34:23]:

Yeah.

Andrew Pace [00:34:23]:

Because I'm like, oh my god. Fast TV. Good livestreams. Good feeds. Yes.

Shane Mercer [00:34:27]:

Yeah.

Andrew Pace [00:34:28]:

Or whatever the fuck you want. I'm in. But the fact that it's Pluto, Roku, Zumo, that to me implies, like, extreme latency. So I really don't know where they're going with this. I'm I'm here for it, though, is is, I guess, all I can really say. The more companies that get involved in this whole streaming space and the more competitive it gets, hopefully leads to these faster feeds. And I know that, you know, we we bring it up. YouTube TV, they they took over the NFL.

Andrew Pace [00:35:00]:

People complained like freaking crazy, and then they did improve their latency, and and offered a bit of a better product. So, yeah, in in the name Fast TV, like, I mean, hopefully, that means that they're they're broadcasting things live. They did say in the article, Shane, that it is the actual video platform of, the what's going on at the event, which usually means it's pretty quick. Yeah.

Shane Mercer [00:35:27]:

Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. So, you know, I would imagine that it it you know, it'll it'll be some, you know, there'll be some latency, but, you know, will it be, like, you know, the NBA on on TNT right now? I hope not. You know, that that's pretty bad, for anybody out there who's been watching it or try to try to sort of keep up with the books. But, you know, I I imagine that it'll be, you know, something reasonable. When I when I see this, I think to myself, is FanDuel having an issue with profitability? Right? Because we we've sort of talked about this a little bit, you know, in the past. We talked about DraftKings, I think, specifically, you know, and and its, you know, path to profitability, not necessarily looking as as certain as it once was.

Shane Mercer [00:36:10]:

And and even with the rise of sports betting and and sort of, you know, the dark side of things and people losing a lot of money, these sportsbooks are still having a challenging time out there. And, to me, this is like FanDuel's wanting to enter the streaming space. It's gonna run something for free. Right? So you can go and watch these other sports that you probably wouldn't be betting on. You know, if you're in North America, these are things that you you know? I don't know how much Korean soccer you're betting on. Right? If you're in a North a North American sports fan. Maybe. You know? But but probably unlikely.

Shane Mercer [00:36:42]:

But if you can watch it, maybe you will bet on it. Right? And this might be a way to get, you know, for FanDuel to get people betting on things they might normally not bet on. And the other side of it is, hey. They're gonna be running ads on this. So so now you might go you might you might bet on, you know, Turkish basketball. Now you might be watching Turkish basketball because it's available to you, and and it it'll encourage you a bet more. But at the same time too, they're gonna be able to to, deliver ads to you, and they're gonna be able to capitalize on some ad revenue in the process as well. To me, it it it it sort of screams like we need to find other paths to profitability.

Andrew Pace [00:37:23]:

Yeah. And you just never know what comes of it. Right? Like, if you do have this free platform when other, sports related streaming services are charging, that could lead to a a user base that could be capitalized on separately of the sportsbook and despite the fact that it's encouraging betting separately the sportsbook. So to give you guys some information, Flutter Entertainment is the publicly traded stock that owns FanDuel. So you can't directly buy FanDuel. But we're not comparing apples to apples here. FanDuel's market cap, which essentially is their current valuation based on, market activity in the stock market, It's 28,750,000,000 USD. DraftKings is 20.49.

Andrew Pace [00:38:07]:

Now DraftKings is again, it's not apples to apples because Flutter is involved in more than just the the sportsbook itself. But in both cases, their the PE ratio when you search is a dash, which just means that it's it's negative, and that's profit to earnings. So when you talk about, like, you know, are they profitable and are they looking for new ways to make money? Well, I think profitability for these regulate major regulated sportsbooks, is a bit of a challenge. Right? Meanwhile, if you look up a company like, say, like MGM Resorts or Caesars, You know, these are companies that obviously, you know, they, they have, a whole series of, you know, obviously, their their hotels and and all the all those types of things. They have positive price to earnings ratios. They've been established for much longer. Sports betting is a part of their enterprise, but MGM has been taking sports bets over the counter for decades. So there is a little bit more of an element in those sportsbooks of knowing how to run profitable businesses and having shareholders that they've had to answer to for 4 decades.

Andrew Pace [00:39:25]:

So market cap for MGM Resorts is actually less than FanDuel and DraftKings despite the fact that they have, you know, their hotels and everything that they offer, 12,860,000,000 market cap, but price to earnings ratio of 15.75. So a a profitable, a profitable company. Right? So, you know, there might be some envy from mark from a company like MGM looking at the the the overall market position of a company like FanDuel where they go, oh, FanDuel has a bigger handle than we have. There might be a little bit a little bit of envy there. But there's a huge difference between running a profitable business and running a business that people love to to use that has a lot of users that is not making money. And, yeah, certainly, I think FanDuel falls into that category.

Shane Mercer [00:40:15]:

Yeah. Totally falls into that category. You know, it's something like MGM or Caesars. Right? Sports betting is something that, you know, they they probably feel, you know, they're compelled to offer. They've been offering it already for a long time, but it also helps bring you into their ecosystem. Right? Now they'll, you know, sell you deals on hotels when you go to Vegas. Right? And, you know, they'll they'll, you know, maybe try to push you towards their casinos like you kind of mentioned earlier. So so, you know, there's a a lot of benefit for them being in the sports, betting realm, that that may, you know, not have anything to do with trying to turn a profit off of sports itself.

Shane Mercer [00:40:51]:

Right?

Andrew Pace [00:40:53]:

Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly.

Shane Mercer [00:40:55]:

Alright. Well, Pace, we covered a lot of ground today. Lot a lot of, interesting topics there, and we'll continue to sort of keep, keep our ears to the ground and, you know, keep keeping an eye on all things sports betting related, and there is no topic we won't we won't talk about or cover here on the show. But, Pase, I think that just about does it for this week. Anything you wanna mention before we say goodbye?

Andrew Pace [00:41:17]:

Yeah. Absolutely. So something, for for people that, potentially, have been with us in the past that still follow our podcast or people that have found our podcast and are interested in our community, we do have a free Discord, section, inside that you can join in. We're we're not giving out free picks and doing all that stuff that, I think a lot of this industry is is really, really pro doing. But there is the ability to interact with some of our members in there, and you can jump on our free Discord and and you can actually then DM, you know, guys like Shane or myself directly, and and ask us any questions. You can always do that on on our social channels as well. But, yeah, if you do have any curiosities there, hop into our free Discord. We are doing some q and a's, for free people that are in the free section that include, some membership giveaways.

Andrew Pace [00:42:11]:

And, also, there is gonna be the ability to, view our masterclass, through the free section, which teaches our philosophies on on how to win, over the long term. So if you guys are interested at all in getting more involved but aren't quite ready to dive into the community itself, in the paid version, jump into our free Discord server, and and and have a chat with some of our guys. That's a great way to do it. And if you are looking to buy, obviously, use the promo code there 'BEHINDTHELINES'.

Shane Mercer [00:42:40]:

Wow. Holy crap. You're giving away some of the master class for free? That's nuts. That's insane. Why even I wish I had that when I joined.

Andrew Pace [00:42:48]:

Well, no. You joined. You had already joined.

Shane Mercer [00:42:50]:

But I wish I had it before I joined, and I could've I could've gone and, you know, take it in some of that. That's amazing that you guys are offering the master class or at least some of the master class for free. For anybody out there that that is like, oh, yeah. Well, what is it? Something to to just pull you deep. No. The mat like, the master class is is, I would argue, one of the most valuable parts of inplayLIVE. And so, if you're gonna if pace, if you're giving that away, for free, I mean, that is that is unbelievable.

Andrew Pace [00:43:19]:

It's not as simple as just that. It's not as simple as just that.

Andrew Pace [00:43:22]:

But, like, for example, if you attend one of our q and a's, you're gonna have a a window to watch some of it, essentially, is what's what's gonna occur, after it.

Shane Mercer [00:43:31]:

So they get more detail on that if you They get the q and a and they get the master class because the q and a, I'm sure, will be full of value as well.

Andrew Pace [00:43:38]:

But wait there's more! haha

Shane Mercer [00:43:38]:

No. It's it's kinda crazy, though. It's it's amazing. So, hey. Somebody gets to come on. They get to pick your brain. Right? Ask ask you questions.

Shane Mercer [00:43:46]:

And then on top of that, they get access to the master class.

Andrew Pace [00:43:51]:

Potentially, yes.

Shane Mercer [00:43:52]:

That's amazing. Incredible. What a deal. What a deal. Wow. That's, like, exciting for me to even kinda learn about. And, yeah, as I mentioned too, in the free Discord, you can message me. You can message Face, anybody else in the community.

Shane Mercer [00:44:02]:

Incredible stuff. Alright, buddy. Good, good chatting with you as always, and, till next week, keep eating those books. Thanks for tuning in to another episode of Behind the Lines. Remember to like, download, and subscribe. We are on YouTube, Apple, Spotify, and everywhere you get your podcasts. Have a betting story or wanna be featured on our podcast? Drop a note in the comments below. And if you wanna join inplayLIVE, use promo code 'BEHINDTHELINES'.